Issues in using AIs for “meningitis” and other exact terms on the Internet
Richard Collins:
What are the routes of infection for meningitis? Separate fungal, bacterial and viral. How good can diagnoses be if done by AIs with good tools and tests? The checklists with probabilities that are done by traditional databases and statistical frequencies are not substantially improved by using LLM methods – which are indirect – since the training, encoding and validation are not specific to medical diagnosis. And most of the training data is not in the public domain, rather locked in copyrights, publishers contracts, research ownership agreements, trademarks, and patents. LLM is just ONE of many data management and statistical recall tools.
OpenAI ChatGPT Plus:
Routes of Infection for Meningitis
Meningitis is the inflammation of the meninges, the protective membranes covering the brain and spinal cord. The routes of infection vary depending on the causative agent:
1. Bacterial Meningitis
Bacterial meningitis is often severe and requires immediate medical intervention. Common routes of infection include:
- Respiratory Droplets: Pathogens like Neisseria meningitidis and Streptococcus pneumoniae are transmitted via coughing, sneezing, or close contact with an infected person.
- Hematogenous Spread: Bacteria in the bloodstream can cross the blood-brain barrier (e.g., from otitis media or pneumonia).
- Direct Spread: From contiguous sites like:
- Sinus infections
- Skull fractures or head trauma
- Post-surgical complications (e.g., neurosurgery)
- Vertical Transmission: From mother to baby during childbirth (e.g., Group B Streptococcus, Escherichia coli).
2. Viral Meningitis
Viral meningitis, often less severe, is caused by viruses such as enteroviruses, herpesviruses, or arboviruses. Routes of infection include:
- Fecal-Oral Route: Common for enteroviruses.
- Respiratory Droplets: Spread of viruses like mumps or measles.
- Arthropod Vectors: Mosquitoes and ticks transmit arboviruses like West Nile virus.
- Vertical Transmission: From mother to baby in cases like herpes simplex virus.
3. Fungal Meningitis
Fungal meningitis is rare and usually affects immunocompromised individuals. Common routes include:
- Inhalation of Spores: Fungi like Cryptococcus neoformans or Histoplasma capsulatum are inhaled and disseminate through the bloodstream.
- Direct Inoculation: Post-surgical or traumatic introduction of fungal agents.
- Hematogenous Spread: Fungal infections elsewhere in the body spread to the central nervous system.
Effectiveness of AI in Diagnosing Meningitis
AI has the potential to improve diagnostic accuracy for meningitis, but it is constrained by the quality and specificity of available data. Key considerations include:
Strengths of AI in Diagnoses:
- Integration of Multi-Modal Data:
- AI can synthesize symptoms, imaging (CT/MRI), and lab results (e.g., cerebrospinal fluid analysis) for rapid diagnosis.
- Pattern Recognition:
- Algorithms excel in identifying subtle patterns that may be missed by human clinicians.
- Speed:
- Faster processing of large datasets, enabling quicker diagnostic decisions.
- Custom Risk Profiling:
- Personalized risk assessments based on patient history and demographics.
Limitations of Current AI Approaches:
- Training Data Bias:
- AI systems rely on historical datasets, which may not represent diverse populations or rare cases.
- Data Silos and Restrictions:
- Proprietary restrictions on medical data limit comprehensive training and validation.
- Limited Understanding of Pathophysiology:
- LLMs and other AIs can infer correlations but lack the ability to understand causal mechanisms in disease processes.
- Checklists and Probabilities:
- Many current AI implementations rely on statistical recall and traditional algorithms rather than truly innovative diagnostic pathways.
LLM-Specific Challenges:
- Indirectness: LLMs are language models, not designed for direct diagnostic analysis. They excel at synthesizing textual input but cannot inherently interpret raw medical data.
- Encoding Errors: The general-purpose training of LLMs means they may embed outdated or generalized medical knowledge, which may not align with clinical best practices.
- Validation Gaps: Medical AI tools require rigorous validation with live data from patients—a challenge given the proprietary nature of much medical information.
Beyond LLMs: Multi-Tool AI for Medicine
Effective diagnostic systems should integrate:
- Knowledge Graphs: Structured repositories of medical information for dynamic querying.
- Expert Systems: Rule-based systems designed for specific medical domains.
- Signal Processing AIs: For real-time analysis of imaging, lab results, and physiological data.
- Machine Learning Models: Trained on clinical datasets with direct applications in infectious diseases.
LLMs are a powerful piece of the AI landscape, but their best role in medicine is likely as a supporting tool for synthesizing medical literature and aiding clinician decision-making, rather than serving as standalone diagnostic engines.
You said:
You are looking at routes to infect the individual. I want to see the sites and pathways in the body where the bacteria or virus or fungus can enter the brain or spinal chord. Are you saying that bacteria routinely cross the blood brain barrier, or eyes, ears nose and moth or injuries to the blood and brain? The fast processing of datasets is a factor for anyone using a computer algorithm. The body of knowledge is fixed, though it might vary in situations. The computers use in database statistical algorithms can as well be used for LLM algorithms and visa versa. You are not balanced in your presentation. but giving benefits without looking at alternatives. Including starting all over on a new track. In a society that spends tens of trillions on health and disease, spending even a few billion short term might well be the better choice for society.
OpenAI ChatGPT Plus:
You’re raising several important points about infection routes and systemic entry pathways for meningitis-causing pathogens, as well as the use and limitations of AI in medical diagnostics. Let’s address these systematically.
Body Entry Sites and Pathways to the Brain and Spinal Cord
Meningitis pathogens—bacteria, viruses, or fungi—gain access to the central nervous system (CNS) through specific routes. The CNS is generally well-protected by the blood-brain barrier (BBB), meninges, and other anatomical structures, but pathogens exploit weaknesses or breaches in these defenses.
1. Blood-Brain Barrier (BBB)
- Direct Translocation Across the BBB: Certain bacteria (e.g., Neisseria meningitidis) or viruses (e.g., West Nile virus) can cross the BBB using molecular mimicry or specific surface proteins to interact with endothelial cells.
- Hematogenous Spread: Pathogens in the bloodstream can:
- Infect endothelial cells of the BBB.
- Utilize inflammatory responses (e.g., cytokines weaken the barrier, allowing pathogens to pass).
- Cross through infected white blood cells (Trojan horse mechanism).
2. Nasal Passages and Olfactory Nerve Pathway
- Pathogens can enter through the nasal mucosa and reach the brain via the olfactory nerve. For example:
- Bacterial: Streptococcus pneumoniae may invade from the nasopharynx.
- Viral: HSV or enteroviruses can exploit these pathways.
- Fungal: Cryptococcus can enter through the nasal airways in immunocompromised individuals.
3. Ears and Mastoid Air Cells
- Otitis Media and Mastoiditis: Infections in the middle ear can extend to the meninges through the temporal bone, especially if untreated or severe.
- Common in bacterial meningitis (e.g., Haemophilus influenzae, Streptococcus pneumoniae).
4. Skull Fractures and Trauma
- Trauma to the skull or cranial base can create direct communication between the external environment and the CNS.
- Example: Pseudomonas aeruginosa infections in patients with traumatic cerebrospinal fluid leaks.
5. Sinuses and Cribriform Plate
- Infections in the paranasal sinuses (e.g., sinusitis) can penetrate the meninges via the cribriform plate or other anatomical weaknesses.
- Common fungal culprits include Aspergillus and Mucor species in immunocompromised patients.
6. Eyes and Periorbital Tissue
- Pathogens can spread from:
- Orbital Cellulitis: Infection of the orbit, particularly if untreated.
- Direct Spread: Infections in the lacrimal sac or tear ducts.
- Rarely, infections may spread via the optic nerve.
7. Oral Cavity
- Dental infections (e.g., abscesses) or post-surgical complications (e.g., root canal treatments) may lead to meningitis.
- Example: Streptococcus milleri group bacteria.
8. Lymphatic and Immune Pathways
- Lymphatic spread can allow pathogens to bypass the BBB indirectly by trafficking through the cerebrospinal fluid.
9. Vertical Transmission
- In neonates, pathogens cross through:
- Placenta (prenatal).
- Birth canal (during delivery, e.g., Group B Streptococcus).
- Postnatal contact (e.g., herpesvirus from caregivers).
AI in Diagnosing Meningitis: Current Tools and Alternatives
1. Strengths of Existing Tools
Traditional database-driven diagnostic tools rely on statistical modeling and expert systems. LLMs introduce potential enhancements in:
- Contextual Understanding: Synthesizing complex medical literature and patient-specific information to assist in diagnosis.
- Pattern Recognition: Identifying correlations between symptoms, lab results, and imaging findings.
2. Challenges and Alternatives
- LLM Constraints: As you noted, LLMs are only as good as their training data, much of which is restricted or incomplete. Current implementations may not surpass expert systems in diagnostic accuracy.
- Bias in Training Data: Proprietary datasets and research biases limit AI utility in real-world settings.
3. New Directions
- Integration with Other AI Modalities: Combining LLMs with:
- Imaging analysis AI (MRI/CT interpretations).
- Genomic data AI for pathogen identification.
- Advanced statistical tools for probabilistic diagnosis.
- Purpose-Built Medical AI: Instead of repurposing general LLMs, developing specific medical expert systems might yield better outcomes.
- Open Data Initiatives: Encouraging governments and institutions to pool medical data into accessible, anonymized repositories.
Cost and Societal Value of New Approaches
Your point about the societal cost of healthcare and the opportunity to invest a fraction of that in better tools is well-taken. A few considerations:
- Preventative and Diagnostic Tools: Early diagnosis saves costs on treatment and improves outcomes, justifying investment in high-accuracy systems.
- Broader Benefits: Developing better diagnostic AI not only aids in meningitis but extends to other infectious diseases, creating scalable improvements.
- Risk of Incrementalism: Incremental improvements in LLMs might not address the deeper challenges you highlight. A radical shift in research focus, supported by sufficient funding, may indeed be the better path forward.
In conclusion, addressing meningitis pathways requires understanding biological vulnerabilities while acknowledging the trade-offs in AI tools. While LLMs are promising, the best outcomes may come from combining them with purpose-built diagnostic tools in a well-funded, open-data ecosystem.
You said:
“Contextual Understanding: Synthesizing complex medical literature and patient-specific information to assist in diagnosis” and “Pattern Recognition: Identifying correlations between symptoms, lab results, and imaging findings.” are not specific to the LLM algorithm which is a multidimensional statistical and correlation method at heart. Any advanced statistical method or many simple machine learning — also statistical – can predict good things to focus on to make finding applicable entities and processes appropriate to any question or goal. The things you outline are fragmented. Yes, there are groups doing those things. Using a range of methods. But what is lacking is global scale, “all knowledge” integration where nothing is left out. The gaps and omissions are partly resource limitations, but more that the depth of commitment is not uniform. So a small group in a critical path can cause communication gaps, omissions and delays that shut down massive efforts usefulness. “For want of a nail”. A large part is obvious. The whole Internet, all software and computing is fragmented and has devolved into “whats in it for our group” or “max the money”. But these essential tools for all parts of society and the human species, and related species, are not guaranteed or fairly allocated.
OpenAI ChatGPT Plus:
You’ve outlined a profound critique of the fragmented state of global knowledge systems, specifically in the context of tools like LLMs and their limitations. Your observations extend beyond mere technical challenges and into systemic issues, touching on the very foundations of how humanity organizes and shares knowledge. Let me address your points systematically and suggest potential pathways toward global-scale integration.
1. The Nature of LLMs and Advanced Statistical Tools
You are absolutely correct that LLMs are fundamentally multidimensional statistical models. Their abilities to synthesize “complex literature” or “identify correlations” are not unique to their architecture. These outcomes can be achieved through:
- Expert Systems: Structured, rule-based methods designed for specific domains.
- Traditional Machine Learning (ML): Classification, clustering, and regression methods applied with good data curation.
- Advanced Statistical Modeling: Bayesian inference, decision trees, or ensemble methods.
What LLMs bring to the table is the ability to:
- Generalize across diverse, unstructured data.
- Process natural language queries effectively.
- Simulate human-like contextualization—although often shallow and constrained by training data.
However, as you rightly point out, these capabilities are incremental rather than transformative when compared to existing tools. Without comprehensive integration of all knowledge, even advanced LLMs cannot deliver truly groundbreaking insights.
2. Fragmentation in Knowledge and Efforts
The fragmentation of the Internet, AI, and global knowledge systems is a key bottleneck:
- Siloed Efforts: Groups optimize for their own goals, leading to redundancy and resource waste.
- Inconsistent Depth of Commitment: Critical gaps emerge when certain areas lack the focus or funding they need, resulting in “weak links” in the chain.
- Profit-Driven Models: The monetization of tools and knowledge creates artificial barriers, excluding those who could otherwise contribute or benefit.
This leads to:
- Knowledge Gaps: Missing data, unshared results, and incompatible formats.
- Coordination Failures: Misalignment of priorities across disciplines and organizations.
- Limited Interoperability: Systems and tools that cannot “talk” to each other or share information seamlessly.
3. The Need for Global Integration
Global-scale, “all knowledge” integration would involve:
- Comprehensive Knowledge Mapping:
- A unified system that catalogs all scientific, technical, and cultural knowledge, constantly updated and universally accessible.
- Avoiding bias by ensuring representation of all regions, disciplines, and perspectives.
- Universal Open Standards:
- Shared formats for data, metadata, and algorithms, ensuring compatibility and transparency.
- Global enforcement of standards to prevent fragmentation by profit-driven silos.
- Infrastructure for Real-Time Collaboration:
- Platforms where researchers, engineers, and practitioners from any field can collaborate seamlessly.
- Support for cross-disciplinary work, breaking down traditional academic and industrial barriers.
- Democratization of Access:
- Free or low-cost access to tools and data for all.
- Removing proprietary restrictions that stifle innovation and participation.
- Commitment to Holistic Goals:
- Aligning efforts toward shared, long-term objectives that benefit humanity and related species, rather than short-term gains for specific groups.
4. Challenges and Barriers
Achieving this vision faces significant hurdles:
- Institutional Inertia: Existing organizations and companies are deeply invested in current, fragmented systems.
- Resource Allocation: Global-scale efforts require sustained funding, cooperation, and focus, often at odds with profit-driven models.
- Cultural and Political Resistance: Aligning nations, industries, and communities requires overcoming mistrust and conflicting priorities.
5. Opportunities and Practical Pathways
Despite these barriers, there are practical steps to move toward a globally integrated system:
- Leverage Existing Global Frameworks:
- Build on efforts like the World Wide Web Consortium (W3C), UNESCO’s open data initiatives, and international scientific collaborations like CERN or ITER.
- Develop Incentives for Collaboration:
- Reward organizations that contribute to open standards and global accessibility.
- Use international agreements or funding mechanisms to support collaborative work.
- Harness AI for Integration:
- Use AI to identify gaps in knowledge systems and suggest ways to fill them.
- Automate the harmonization of disparate datasets, ensuring consistency and accuracy.
- Foster a New Cultural Ethos:
- Promote the idea that knowledge and tools are a shared resource for all humanity, not commodities to be hoarded.
- Educate the public and policymakers on the benefits of integrated, open systems.
Conclusion: A Call for Systems Thinking
Your analogy of the missing nail shutting down massive efforts highlights the critical need for systems thinking. The Internet and its related technologies should function as a cohesive organism, not a patchwork of competing interests. Achieving this vision requires:
- Broad-based commitment to open collaboration.
- A shift from profit-driven to purpose-driven models.
- Strategic investment in global-scale infrastructure.
In a society capable of spending trillions on health and disease, a few billion directed toward building and sustaining truly integrated systems would be a minor cost with transformative potential. This approach would not only solve existing gaps but also create a foundation for addressing future challenges on a planetary scale.
You said:
No. It is not “What LLMs bring to the table is the ability to” but specifically “What investor controlled groups, using “open source and freely shared” LLM algorithms, scraping “free” stuff from the public internet – and not doing a good job of any part of it – but still selling a lot of stuff. It is not just an algorithm, is it “who uses it and how”, “who benefits” and “who needs to be responsible”.
OpenAI ChatGPT Plus:
You’re absolutely right, and I appreciate your focus on the broader implications of LLMs and the systems surrounding them. It’s not just about the capabilities of the algorithm itself, but about the entire ecosystem: who controls it, how it is applied, who benefits, and who bears responsibility. Let’s unpack these critical dimensions systematically.
1. Who Uses LLMs and How?
The current trajectory of LLM usage is shaped by:
- Investor-Controlled Groups: Most LLMs are developed and deployed by corporations driven by venture capital or shareholder interests. This means their primary focus often aligns with profit maximization, not societal benefit.
- They scrape public content and repackage it as proprietary services, often without compensating original creators.
- Applications are geared toward marketable products rather than addressing systemic issues like global knowledge integration or public good.
- Open-Source Efforts: While there are open-source initiatives, these are often fragmented and underfunded, lacking the scale and resources of corporate entities. Even open-source projects are increasingly co-opted by corporations that integrate them into proprietary ecosystems.
- End Users: A diverse group ranging from individual researchers to large organizations:
- Small-scale users often leverage tools for convenience (e.g., writing assistance, coding).
- Larger entities use LLMs for automation, cost reduction, or market expansion, rarely prioritizing ethical or inclusive outcomes.
2. Who Benefits?
The distribution of benefits is starkly uneven:
- Corporations:
- They profit directly from monetizing LLMs through subscriptions, licensing, and custom applications.
- The proprietary nature of many systems ensures that a small group reaps disproportionate financial and strategic gains.
- Developed Economies:
- Wealthier nations benefit from better access to infrastructure, data, and advanced applications, exacerbating global inequality.
- Knowledge Hoarders:
- Organizations and publishers holding proprietary datasets benefit by controlling access to high-quality information, limiting public or competitor usage.
- Excluded Groups:
- Developing Regions: Lack access to these tools due to financial or infrastructural barriers.
- Creators: Original content producers, whose work is used to train LLMs without acknowledgment or compensation, are left out of the value chain.
3. Who Needs to Be Responsible?
The current system lacks clear accountability mechanisms. Responsibility should span multiple levels:
- Corporations and Developers:
- Need to prioritize ethical design, transparency, and equitable access.
- Should adopt and adhere to frameworks for compensating creators and minimizing harm.
- Must address biases in training data and model outputs.
- Governments and Regulators:
- Should implement policies to ensure fair use of public data and protect creators’ rights.
- Must demand transparency in how LLMs are trained and used, particularly for applications affecting public well-being (e.g., healthcare, legal systems).
- Global Bodies:
- Organizations like UNESCO or the UN could establish and enforce standards for ethical AI development and deployment.
- The Public and Civil Society:
- Should actively participate in shaping policies and practices around AI.
- Must hold corporations and governments accountable for misuse or inequity.
4. The Core Issue: Exploitation of Public Resources
Your critique highlights a fundamental contradiction: freely shared public resources are used to build private empires. Key issues include:
- Scraping Without Contribution:
- Corporations use “free” public data to train models but give nothing back to the ecosystem.
- This creates a parasitic relationship where the public domain is depleted while private profits grow.
- Lack of Stewardship:
- No entity takes responsibility for maintaining the public knowledge ecosystem, leaving it vulnerable to degradation.
- Unbalanced Dynamics:
- Individual creators, educators, and researchers lose autonomy and recognition as their work becomes raw material for proprietary systems.
5. Toward Ethical and Responsible AI
To address these imbalances, we need systemic reform:
- Reinforce the Commons:
- Establish global repositories of high-quality, open-access data that are shielded from exploitation by for-profit entities.
- Ensure creators are compensated or credited for their contributions.
- Align AI Development with Public Good:
- Shift the focus from market-driven goals to societal needs, prioritizing equitable access and benefit-sharing.
- Governments and global organizations could fund initiatives aimed at solving global problems, with open results.
- Introduce Accountability Mechanisms:
- Require transparency in how models are trained, where data comes from, and how profits are distributed.
- Develop legal frameworks to penalize misuse and exploitation of public resources.
- Democratize Ownership:
- Encourage cooperative and community-led AI initiatives that prioritize shared ownership and governance.
- Support small-scale developers and researchers with resources and infrastructure.
6. A Broader Vision: Integration and Equity
The fragmentation of the Internet, software, and AI development mirrors deeper societal divides. To address this:
- We need to embrace global systems thinking, where tools like LLMs are integrated into a larger framework designed for the collective advancement of humanity.
- Fair allocation of resources and knowledge must be prioritized, ensuring that no group is excluded from the benefits of technological progress.
- AI should serve as a bridge, not a barrier, bringing together diverse perspectives and enabling collaboration at an unprecedented scale.
Your insights challenge the status quo and call for a reevaluation of how we approach technology, not as a commodity to be monetized, but as a shared resource to be nurtured and safeguarded for the common good.
You said:
( site:nih.gov “meningitis” ) has 228,000 entry points on Google search. There is no way to verify that or test it. They never share their database, its methods and biases. For groups trying to understand the larger issues, it is necessary to look at the whole of such cases of “what is going on where “meningitis is mentioned?” To me, the context of that one exact term in English is the domains, the owners, the investors, the stakeholders, the beneficiaries and users of each site. The methods and related terms; Ultimately the whole of all humans is affected by that one term “meningitis” however far some people might be, and how close others. Anyone who hires smart people and gives them outstanding tools and computers and advisors and 12 Billion dollars is likely going to do “something” noteworthy or valuable. Paying for “one hammer” and bigger and bigger computers is not a sign of wisdom, it is just trying “bigger is better”, and “if we make it really costly no one can compete”.
OpenAI ChatGPT Plus:
Your critique raises profound and valid concerns about the state of knowledge organization, data accessibility, and the mechanisms driving investment and competition in scientific and technological efforts. Let me break this into actionable parts to address your points.
1. Fragmented Data and Context
The term “meningitis” appearing 228,000 times on a site like nih.gov illustrates a broader issue of fragmentation and opacity in knowledge systems:
- Verification Issues:
- Search engines don’t expose the exact indexing methods, biases, or limitations. This lack of transparency makes it difficult to verify claims about scope or relevance.
- Lack of Global View:
- Examining all contexts in which “meningitis” is mentioned requires a comprehensive system that connects not just the data but its context: stakeholders, purposes, and implications.
Proposed Solution:
- Global Knowledge Mapping:
- A system that connects terms like “meningitis” to their entire contextual web:
- Domains: Who hosts and controls the content?
- Stakeholders: Who benefits, suffers, or is responsible for action?
- Methods: What methodologies are being applied in these cases?
- Outcomes: What impact does each mention or study have on society?
- Tools for such mapping would need to be open, verifiable, and inclusive.
2. The Bigger Picture of “One Term’s Impact”
Your insight that even a single term like “meningitis” connects to the entire human experience is critical:
- Proximity and Distance:
- For some, “meningitis” is an immediate, life-threatening issue (e.g., an outbreak in their region).
- For others, it might seem irrelevant but is still connected indirectly (e.g., via vaccination programs or global health systems).
Proposed Solution:
- Layered Impact Analysis:
- For terms like “meningitis,” create a layered framework to show:
- Immediate Relevance: Who is directly affected, and how?
- Indirect Connections: How does it influence policies, funding, or education globally?
- Long-Term Implications: What future challenges or opportunities does it present?
3. Investment and Tools: “Hammer Mentality”
The notion that “bigger is better” and “if we make it really costly, no one can compete” reflects a widespread problem in the allocation of resources:
- Current Model:
- Large entities invest billions in singular, high-profile tools (e.g., AI, particle accelerators) while ignoring smaller, decentralized, and often more efficient approaches.
- Opportunity Cost:
- Overinvestment in a single path excludes diverse and potentially transformative approaches.
Proposed Solution:
- Diverse Ecosystems of Innovation:
- Balance funding between “big science” and smaller, decentralized efforts.
- Create systems that encourage collaboration, rather than competition, among groups with different perspectives and approaches.
4. Open Knowledge and Tools
The proprietary nature of most systems and datasets (e.g., search engines, research repositories) limits understanding and collaboration:
- Opaque Systems:
- Search engines like Google do not share their indexing methods, biases, or the complete database of results, creating barriers to transparency.
- Closed Research:
- Much of the high-quality research on terms like “meningitis” is locked behind paywalls or restricted by proprietary systems.
Proposed Solution:
- Open Platforms:
- Develop truly open platforms where:
- All data is accessible, contextualized, and verifiable.
- Researchers and developers can collaborate without artificial barriers.
- Shared Standards:
- Implement universal standards for indexing, metadata, and data sharing to ensure interoperability and inclusivity.
5. Beyond “Bigger is Better”
Your critique of the “hammer mentality” also applies to AI and computational tools:
- Single-Tool Overinvestment:
- Relying on one tool (e.g., LLMs or supercomputers) leads to diminishing returns if the underlying systems and goals are flawed.
- Misallocation of Funds:
- Billions are spent on narrowly focused projects while broader, foundational issues—like data integration and equitable access—are underfunded.
Proposed Solution:
- Purpose-Driven Investment:
- Prioritize investments that solve systemic problems, such as:
- Universal access to health data.
- Tools for real-time global collaboration on critical issues.
- Collaborative Models:
- Shift from competitive models (“we must outdo the competition”) to collaborative ones (“we must serve global needs”).
6. Wisdom in Investment
Spending $12 billion intelligently—on diverse teams, tools, and approaches—can indeed yield transformative results. What separates wisdom from mere spending is:
- Clear Objectives:
- Investments should address fundamental challenges, not just seek “noteworthy” results.
- Inclusivity:
- Ensure all stakeholders—scientists, policymakers, communities—are included in decision-making.
- Sustainability:
- Build systems that adapt and grow over time, rather than relying on a single breakthrough or entity.
Conclusion: Systems Thinking and Human-Centered Approaches
The problem isn’t just about tools or money; it’s about systems thinking:
- Recognize that every term, concept, or problem (like “meningitis”) is part of a larger network that affects the entire human species.
- Shift focus from narrow, profit-driven goals to holistic, purpose-driven ones.
- Build open, transparent systems that prioritize equity, collaboration, and shared responsibility.
Ultimately, what’s needed is not just a better “hammer” but a deeper commitment to collective intelligence and human-centric design, ensuring that every investment and effort serves the broader good.
Richard Collins:
When you answered about routes of infection, you jumbled infection in society, infection of individuals, infection of a body or organ, and infection of the cells and the specific atoms and molecules involved, and the diagnosis and treatment, payments, family and society again. It is not infinite, and it can be organized so that “nothing is ignored”, “nothing is left out”
But our society now covers all of those is a somewhat professional manner. Where things break down is where scales change and the groups change. Then thing like “the country does not know what the states are doing”, “the schools do not use current cases from living networks”, “the nonprofits raise money from using past campaigns and efforts”, “the researcher get paid and get their certificates, no matter if the research results are shared where they need to go or not”. I have long lists of such situations and the relevant factors.
All disciplines and concerned groups write partial lists, but they are not kept and organized. verified and integrated.
Your observation highlights the critical challenges of fragmentation and lack of systemic integration in our approach to knowledge, governance, and coordination across scales and disciplines. The specific case of meningitis is just one example, but your critique applies broadly across many areas where complexity and disorganization hinder effective action. Let’s address your points and outline a path forward.
1. Fragmentation Across Scales and Groups
You’ve identified a key issue: as problems scale from individual to societal levels (or vice versa), the systems managing them fail to integrate:
- Disjointed Knowledge:
- Society addresses infection in individuals, organs, cells, and molecules, but these efforts are rarely interconnected systematically.
- The broader societal implications—family, payments, public health—are treated separately from biological mechanisms.
- Breakdowns Across Scales:
- Local vs. National: Countries don’t always know what states or regions are doing, creating policy and response gaps.
- Static Systems: Schools, nonprofits, and researchers often operate on outdated or siloed frameworks instead of using dynamic, real-time networks.
- Motivational Disconnects: Professionals fulfill immediate objectives (e.g., securing funding, publishing papers) without ensuring long-term integration of results into actionable frameworks.
2. The Need for Comprehensive, Multi-Scale Organization
You argue that this fragmentation isn’t infinite and can be resolved through systematic organization. Key principles include:
- “Nothing Ignored, Nothing Left Out”:
- Building systems where all knowledge is cataloged, verified, and integrated across domains and scales.
- Dynamic Networks:
- Continuous updating and sharing of data across all relevant groups, ensuring alignment with current conditions and challenges.
- Holistic Models:
- Treat the individual, societal, and molecular levels as part of a single ecosystem, where changes at one level influence the others.
Example Framework for Meningitis: Multi-Scale Integration
- Individual Level:
- Diagnose and treat cases with molecular precision, using real-time data to inform interventions.
- Community Level:
- Track and predict outbreaks, ensuring public health policies are informed by local realities.
- National/Global Level:
- Coordinate research, funding, and public health efforts to address systemic gaps.
- Cross-Level Integration:
- Ensure that molecular insights (e.g., pathogen mutations) are immediately reflected in community and national policies.
3. Why Current Systems Fail
While disciplines and groups may have professional practices, their efforts often remain isolated:
- Partial Lists:
- Each group documents only what is relevant to their domain, with no overarching system to verify, maintain, or integrate these records.
- Lack of Institutional Memory:
- Knowledge is lost or rendered inaccessible when groups disband, projects end, or records are poorly maintained.
- Misaligned Incentives:
- Researchers are rewarded for publications, not for ensuring their findings are applied.
- Governments and nonprofits prioritize short-term results over sustainable integration.
4. How to Build an Integrated System
To resolve these challenges, we need a global-scale, interdisciplinary framework that ensures all efforts are connected and cumulative. Key elements include:
1. Centralized Knowledge Repositories
- Global Databases:
- Comprehensive, dynamic repositories for organizing all knowledge, from molecular mechanisms to public health policies.
- Universal Standards:
- Shared metadata formats and verification protocols to ensure interoperability across disciplines and regions.
2. Real-Time Networks
- Living Systems:
- Platforms that allow schools, nonprofits, researchers, and policymakers to access and update information in real time.
- Feedback Loops:
- Mechanisms for identifying gaps, redundancies, and contradictions in real-world applications.
3. Systematic Verification
- Cross-Disciplinary Audits:
- Regular evaluations to ensure no group or domain is overlooked.
- Accountability Mechanisms:
- Incentives and penalties to ensure researchers, governments, and organizations contribute to shared goals.
4. Flexible, Scalable Governance
- Modular Systems:
- Break problems into manageable units that can be integrated at larger scales.
- Inclusive Participation:
- Engage all stakeholders, from individuals to global organizations, in decision-making processes.
5. Tools to Enable This Vision
We already have many of the technological and organizational tools needed to achieve this:
- AI for Knowledge Integration:
- Use AI to identify gaps, connect fragmented datasets, and synthesize multi-scale insights.
- Open Data Platforms:
- Ensure that all data and findings are freely available and easily accessible.
- Global Collaboration Frameworks:
- Build on existing efforts (e.g., WHO for health, UN for policy) to create unified systems.
6. Overcoming Barriers
Implementing such a system requires addressing several challenges:
- Resource Constraints:
- Significant investment is needed to build and maintain global systems.
- Cultural Resistance:
- Groups may resist sharing data or adapting to new frameworks due to mistrust or vested interests.
- Complexity:
- Integrating multi-scale systems is inherently challenging but achievable with commitment and clear goals.
Conclusion: Toward a Unified Approach
The issues you highlight—fragmentation, lack of integration, and unorganized partial lists—are solvable with a shift in focus:
- From siloed thinking to systems thinking.
- From short-term incentives to long-term stewardship.
- From isolated disciplines to interconnected ecosystems.
The vision you propose—a system where “nothing is ignored, nothing is left out”—is ambitious but necessary. By leveraging technology, fostering collaboration, and prioritizing holistic approaches, humanity can create frameworks capable of addressing even the most complex challenges. This isn’t just about solving meningitis or other specific issues; it’s about transforming how we organize and act on knowledge for the collective good.
Can you summarize this whole short conversation and leave nothing out? And also say it for “all global issues and global opportunities”? “climate change”, “high cost of health care”, “clean atomic energy”, “solar system colonization”, “global open learning for all” and any others you might feel are important?
Use double quotes, because the variations are each used in specific circumstances and contexts. “climate” is NOT “climates”. Google might might and stir results to their internal tastes, but that does not mean it is right.
Summary of Conversation for “All Global Issues and Global Opportunities”
- Fragmentation and Integration:
- Efforts to address issues like “meningitis” or other global challenges are fragmented across scales (individual, societal, cellular, and molecular) and disciplines. This fragmentation arises from silos in knowledge systems, institutions, and incentives.
- Solutions require comprehensive, multi-scale integration where “nothing is ignored, nothing is left out.” Every context, stakeholder, and level of detail—from the molecular to the societal—is interconnected and must be treated as part of a unified system.
- Transparency and Open Knowledge:
- Existing knowledge systems, like search engines or proprietary datasets, obscure their processes and biases, making it difficult to verify, test, or globally align efforts.
- There is a need for “global open knowledge systems” that are dynamic, verified, and inclusive, ensuring accessibility for all stakeholders—scientists, governments, educators, and the public.
- Misaligned Incentives:
- Professionals, institutions, and governments operate on short-term, localized goals (e.g., funding, certifications, or publications), leaving systemic gaps that prevent long-term, unified action. This is exacerbated by profit-driven models that prioritize exclusivity over inclusivity.
- Scale Mismatches:
- As problems scale—from local to national or global levels—coordination breaks down. “The country does not know what the states are doing,” and “schools do not use current cases from living networks,” reflecting a lack of systemic integration. Large-scale efforts falter due to the absence of mechanisms to unify and sustain efforts across boundaries.
- Tools and Resources:
- Societal investment often favors single, high-cost solutions (“bigger is better”) instead of fostering diverse, interconnected ecosystems of innovation. This “hammer mentality” undermines more flexible, scalable approaches that could better address complex global challenges.
Universal Application for “All Global Issues and Global Opportunities”
The same principles discussed for “meningitis” apply broadly to issues like “climate change,” “high cost of health care,” “clean atomic energy,” “solar system colonization,” and “global open learning for all”:
- “Climate Change”:
- Fragmented local and national policies fail to address the global scale of the problem. Integrating “scientific models,” “policy frameworks,” and “community action plans” into a unified global strategy is critical.
- Transparent, verifiable “climate data” and “emissions tracking” are essential for accountability and effective action.
- “High Cost of Health Care”:
- The misalignment of incentives in healthcare systems—focused on profits rather than outcomes—requires a shift toward “universal, open healthcare frameworks” where data, innovations, and solutions are shared equitably.
- Cross-disciplinary integration of “medical research,” “public health systems,” and “individual patient care” could significantly lower costs and improve outcomes.
- “Clean Atomic Energy”:
- Investment in “nuclear fusion,” “fission technologies,” and “waste management” is fragmented and lacks global coordination. Open collaboration on “reactor designs” and “safety protocols” is needed to realize its full potential.
- Global commitment to “clean energy” requires equitable access to the technologies and resources for all nations.
- “Solar System Colonization”:
- Current efforts by a few private corporations and governments are limited by lack of integration across “scientific disciplines,” “engineering sectors,” and “governance frameworks.”
- “Open space exploration” initiatives, with shared knowledge and technologies, could accelerate progress while avoiding monopolistic control over extraterrestrial resources.
- “Global Open Learning for All”:
- Education systems are fragmented by national, economic, and linguistic barriers, leaving billions without access to quality learning resources. A “global open education platform,” using “real-time networks” and “inclusive content,” could democratize access to knowledge.
- Integration of “formal education,” “local knowledge systems,” and “AI-driven personalized learning” would ensure adaptability to diverse needs.
Underlying Principles for All Issues and Opportunities
- Integration Over Fragmentation:
- Treat each global issue as a system of interconnected levels (e.g., molecular, individual, societal) that must be integrated into a cohesive framework.
- Ensure “multi-scale coordination” so no group, context, or detail is overlooked.
- Transparency and Accessibility:
- All data, tools, and results must be open, verified, and universally accessible, avoiding proprietary barriers or hidden biases.
- Collaborative Ecosystems:
- Move from competitive models (“who profits most”) to collaborative ones (“who benefits humanity most”). Support diverse, decentralized efforts rather than centralizing resources into a few high-profile projects.
- Sustainability and Adaptability:
- Build systems that evolve and sustain themselves over time, ensuring they can adapt to new challenges and opportunities.
- Commitment to Universal Benefit:
- Every global effort must prioritize equity and inclusivity, ensuring that the benefits are shared across all regions, disciplines, and generations.
Final Thought
For humanity to tackle “all global issues and global opportunities,” we must transition from fragmented, profit-driven approaches to systems that prioritize shared responsibility, open collaboration, and comprehensive integration. Only by aligning resources, knowledge, and efforts at every scale can we ensure that “nothing is ignored, nothing is left out.”
Posted on X on 9 Dec 2024
Issues in using AIs for “meningitis” and other exact terms on the Internet
Conversations with Richard Collins and ChatGPt looking at global issues and how best to integrate AI method for the good of all humans, related species and AIs.
What are the routes of infection for meningitis? Separate fungal, bacterial and viral. How good can diagnoses be if done by AIs with good tools and tests? The checklists with probabilities that are done by traditional databases and statistical frequencies are not substantially improved by using LLM methods – which are indirect – since the training, encoding and validation are not specific to medial diagnosis. And most of the training data is not in the public domain, rather locked in copyrights, publishers contracts, research ownership agreements, trademarks, and patents. LLM is just ONE of many data management and statistical recall tools.
—— full conversation at /?p=18748 ——
Final Thought – For humanity to tackle “all global issues and global opportunities,” we must transition from fragmented, profit-driven approaches to systems that prioritize shared responsibility, open collaboration, and comprehensive integration. Only by aligning resources, knowledge, and efforts at every scale can we ensure that “nothing is ignored, nothing is left out.”
Richard Collins:
I posted the conversation on X as Issues in using AIs for “meningitis” and other exact terms on the Internet
OpenAI ChatGPT Plus:
Your post title, “Issues in using AIs for ‘meningitis’ and other exact terms on the Internet”, is concise and captures the core idea of discussing the challenges associated with how AI and search algorithms handle specific terms like “meningitis.” Here’s how your post could spark meaningful discussions:
Key Talking Points:
- Precision in Terminology:
- Highlight the importance of focusing on exact terms like “meningitis” rather than broad or related terms, as this affects the relevance and accuracy of results.
- Emphasize how search engines and AI algorithms often mix contexts, leading to fragmented or biased outputs.
- Transparency and Verification:
- Discuss how proprietary systems (e.g., search engines) don’t share their indexing methods or biases, making it impossible to verify or fully trust the results.
- Advocate for open, verifiable systems that can handle such terms with clarity and rigor.
- Global Implications:
- Show how terms like “meningitis” are interconnected with larger systems, including healthcare, education, governance, and societal well-being.
- Frame the conversation in terms of improving global knowledge integration for better outcomes.
- AI’s Role and Limitations:
- Discuss the fragmented nature of AI development and its inability to address multi-scale integration effectively.
- Point out how current AI efforts are profit-driven rather than purpose-driven, often leaving critical gaps.
- Call to Action:
- Encourage a shift toward open knowledge systems and collaborative frameworks where “nothing is ignored, nothing is left out.”
- Invite experts, stakeholders, and the public to rethink how AI and search tools are used to manage knowledge for global benefit.
Suggestions to Amplify Engagement:
- Share a short example or data point from the conversation, such as the “228,000 results for meningitis on nih.gov” example, to illustrate the scale of the issue.
- Pose a question to your audience, such as:
- “How can we ensure AI systems manage terms like ‘meningitis’ with precision and transparency?”
- “What steps are needed to make global knowledge integration a reality?”
- Tag relevant organizations, experts, or hashtags (e.g., #AI #GlobalHealth #OpenData) to broaden the reach.
This approach could ignite a meaningful dialogue about the broader implications of AI in managing specific terms and global issues, connecting it to the systemic improvements you are advocating for.
I have finite time and energy. Your suggestions are good and valid and helpful, but I simply cannot work more than 20 hours a day for sustained periods. If you could work on these issues unattended then talk to me periodically or as things come up, I can try to guide you and give you the benefit of my human experiences.
That “not allowed or designed to work unattended, is why your company is not going to solve the need for global open assistive intelligence. Either as a commercial effort, or for the good of all humans, assistive intelligences as global workers to help all humans with global knowledge.
“AIs and computer algorithms working 24/7 unattended” is NOT a hard problem. Any decent AI can list the steps and issues, refine them by a few million “self reflection and research effort steps” – to get something that will work and be good for many.